Transform Your Life Journey: How Spirit-Guided Shamanic Healing Can Change Everything (Bjorn Lestrud Interview)

Transcript

CeeJay Barnaby (00:00)
Welcome to today’s episode of Super Normalized. We’re diving into a transformative journey of Bjorn Lestrud, a storyteller, healer and founder of Blue Dragon Healing. Bjorn’s path began amid the bustling world of high performing sales where his success hid his inner turmoil. His quest for meaning led him through profound teachings like those of Bob Proctor, culminating in pivotal experiences at Light Portal in Tulum. During his awakening,

He was woven with insights from ancient, chants spanning diverse cultures. Beyond unearthed powerful truths found within connections through sound healing modalities such as biofield tuning or plant medicine sessions, most notably among the tribes of the Huni Kuni and the Yawanawa Now living authentically inspired by these coincidence that spark change towards embracing one’s truest self while connecting intuitively and genuinely.

with himself first, but notably also facilitating growth outwards, Bjorn invites listeners onto the same plane, exploring emotional clarity and granting themselves spiritually using methods anchored firmly in joyous engagement alongside passionate uncovering is about one’s true nature. This is a really deep episode with Bjorn and I really appreciate everything that he shared. It was so nice and clear and it’s a huge paradigm shift from somebody that’s, you know, in it’s like a corporate.

box world into the world of connection with spirit in the everyday and using that to help heal people and change the world. On with the show.

Welcome to super normalized, Bjorn Lestrud Bjorn, you’re welcome. And I’m looking forward to talking with you because you have like an evolving sort of story where you were possibly pushed into the world of making lots of money and doing all these sort of things with technology and then being beckoned out of that into another path altogether. So that’s going to be fascinating, I think for me and the listeners, cause you know,

Bjorn (01:34)
Thank you.

CeeJay Barnaby (01:56)
I’m interested in high ticket sales myself. I actually really liked the idea of talking to people and the way the mind works and how it can actually gain understanding through communications and things like that. And it’s pretty much the base of my show is communications. yeah, again, welcome to the show, Bjorn. Where would you like to start with that? mean, how did you actually, what drew you to high ticket sales? I mean, it must’ve been a pretty intensely stressful life for you.

Bjorn (02:20)
Well, the sales that I was in initially was within the financial services industry. And I had started out because when I was just out of college, I read Rich Dad Poor Dad and I got really excited about the prospect of

starting my own business, having that freedom and making money. And I read in the books, like, if you’re going to pursue any skill, learn how to sell. And so I took that to heart and it wasn’t the first job I got out of school, but it was the second job that I got out of school was in sales within financial services. was selling financial products as a financial advisor. I was a licensed advisor.

I had, you know, Series 7, Series 63, life and health insurance licenses. And I eventually moved into a role within that company where I was dealing with people who had large accounts that were trying to move them. So it was like retention sales. And so a lot of the accounts, you know, were

in the hundreds of thousands or million plus dollar accounts. And they were people who had already made the decision to move their money. And it was my job to get them to make a commitment to change their mind. So you can imagine I was dealing with a lot of very unhappy, angry people.

all the time every day.

CeeJay Barnaby (04:03)
Ooh, can imagine how stressful that would be.

Bjorn (04:05)
The most stressful thing about it wasn’t actually the people being upset as much as it was that I learned firsthand how dirty that industry was, financial services and how, most of the people who were being told to move their accounts were working with some sort of financial advisor at another firm and

By and large, I would say the vast majority of the time, almost every time, they were being sold something that would actually put them into a worse situation. But the problem is that the incentives weren’t aligned in their best interest. whoever the advisor was selling them the new product was making a boatload of money to do so, even at their detriment. So.

I felt like I wasn’t necessarily, you know, that usually I was on the right side of the deal ethically, but.

it was not inspiring work and it started to take its toll after a while.

CeeJay Barnaby (05:09)
Sounds like it was a huge challenge to your personal integrity as a person.

Bjorn (05:13)
It was, I felt okay about it then because I was on the right side of the issue most of the time. And so I could speak the truth and I could mean it when I told them that I thought they were getting involved in a worse situation than what they had. But I still felt quite out of alignment with the whole thing. And I just didn’t want to be there.

and I went through a spiritual awakening when I was in that job that completely pushed me out.

CeeJay Barnaby (05:46)
How did that manifest?

Bjorn (05:48)
Well, I was doing a lot of study on personal development and I had been doing that since I was 19, 20 years old. I started reading, know, Way of the Peaceful Warrior, some books by Paula Quaylew, like The Alchemist and some stuff like that, but started getting more into it in my mid 20s. And I was about 27 at the time when I was in this role and I had started to study Bob Proctor.

And so he had this program called the success puzzle and

Bob Proctor, for those who don’t know, he uses this model for thinking about the mind called the stick person concept. He didn’t develop it, but he co-opted it and he gives credit to the person who created it. But basically it’s a way of perceiving or thinking about the mind that brings some order to the way that you think about it by using a diagram. And so it

The top part of the picture of the stick person is a circle. And then there’s a line across the middle of the circle. The top half of the circle represents the conscious mind and the bottom half represents the subconscious mind. Simple enough, right? And then there’s a stick coming down from there and then another little circle at the bottom, which represents the body.

So that in this diagram, the circle representing the mind is actually a lot larger than the one representing the body. It’s all about the mind. And I was on day four of this program, which was all about paradigms. And this was the first time I had learned what a paradigm was. I’d never even been introduced to the concept or the idea that a lot of my behaviors were

potentially influenced by patterns from people that influenced me before I was even able to think for myself. It was a novel idea to me at the time. And so I had been thinking this over in my mind and I just remembered clearly that when I was studying that material that they showed the stick person in the paradigm section, it showed the stick person concept, but they had altered the image because

It was showing like what the stick person is when they’re basically a baby and they essentially removed the top of that head of the circle. And it showed how there were all these other people around the baby and it showed the thought forms coming out of those people were going right into the baby’s head. Like there was basically no protection at the top of the head. And it was kind of just sort of an illustration of

how when you’re really, really little, you get so influenced by all the people around you because you don’t know how to think for yourself and say no. So I had seen that and I had gone to work for the day after studying that the previous night and I was sitting at my desk.

And for some reason I felt inspired to do this little exercise myself. And I wrote down three questions on a piece of paper. The first question was, what’s my most painful memory? And I had thought back to a time when I had gotten bullied when I was 14, 15 years old. And that had stuck in my mind and had been playing on a loop kind of.

So that I wrote that one down. And then the second one was, what are you most grateful for right now? And I can’t quite remember what I wrote for that one. It had something to do with that. I was grateful for how I had developed the skills that I had developed that were serving me in my career. And then the last question was, would I have the thing that I’m most grateful for that

if I had not experienced the more painful thing in the first question. And I connected the dots and I realized, no, actually, I wouldn’t. And in my mind’s eye in that moment, I saw the image of the baby stick person with the open head flip upside down. And I saw all these thought forms.

sort of like squiggly lines, representative squiggly lines, all pouring out of the head. at the simultaneously tears start streaming down my face. And so.

CeeJay Barnaby (10:11)
God,

so you’re doing shadow work at work.

Bjorn (10:14)
Yeah, I didn’t realize that, you know, what that what that was even and and so the tears are streaming down my face. This is 2010. Tears are coming down my face and it is at this moment where everyone’s leaving for the day. So I stand up and I start walking out of the building. The water is gushing down my face, but I don’t feel like like I’m crying in any sort of way that I’ve ever experienced before.

CeeJay Barnaby (10:19)
Yeah.

Bjorn (10:43)
Normally if I would cry, I’ll be feeling bad about something like, and there’d be some tension like in the throat or my face. But this was just like free flowing water gushing through my system. And I felt like I was floating through the streets and it was snow was coming down and.

I probably walked 20 blocks the wrong way without even knowing where I was going. was so just swept up in just euphoric wonder. And I was connecting all these dots as I was walking. I saw how this gratitude that I was feeling from what I had discovered in the exercise was directly connected to feelings of forgiveness that I was feeling towards my father.

and the interpersonal conflicts that I was holding onto, not all of them, but some of them that I was holding onto between myself and him.

And so this whole euphoric thing, it lasted several hours. And then when I went to bed and got up the next day and went into work, I realized that something had shifted in my physical body where I was all of a sudden way more sensitive to the emotions that other people were experiencing.

physical environments, I could, the moment I stepped inside of the building where I worked, my stomach started to hurt and it didn’t stop until I left the building. And it was like that every day from that point on. And so I realized I need to get out of here. I don’t want to do this anymore. I need to do something or find something that I feel in full alignment with that I’m excited about that.

CeeJay Barnaby (12:19)
Whoa.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

Bjorn (12:33)
that connects to these new found feelings and sensitivities that I’m experiencing.

CeeJay Barnaby (12:41)
Wow, that’s wild. And it’s good that you recognize that, because otherwise you wouldn’t be here right now.

Bjorn (12:47)
Maybe I’d be dead, I don’t know.

CeeJay Barnaby (12:48)
Yeah,

well, I mean, sometimes that happens to people. get so stressed out from all of the intensity of things and they don’t recognize what’s happening, but I’m glad you recognized. What happened to you after that? mean, that’s a huge change. mean, it’s like your whole world has been turned upside down, but again, it’s also been made more beautiful. What direction did you go there? mean, how did you get sort of like intuition to go in the right direction and where did you go? What happened?

Bjorn (13:15)
Well, after that, it was kind of a slow churn. mean, that awakening was a very intense, vivid experience, but I didn’t really have anything else occur like that in my life for another 11 years. So I kind of went, you know, yeah, I discovered a new layer of sensitivity within myself and

CeeJay Barnaby (13:32)
Yeah, right.

Bjorn (13:43)
desire to do something that I feel integrity with but it took me a lot of searching and trying different things before I stumbled onto a greater path. I started a couple of businesses, I went back and got a different job but one that I liked more than the previous job and did that for a few years and then finally I cut all of that and I decided I’m just gonna go travel the world.

I spent about five years traveling basically with a backpack and living in 15 different countries. One summer I went around Europe basically by bus or train microdosing on mushrooms.

CeeJay Barnaby (14:25)
Wow, how was that? I bet you would have become like a bit of a stranger tractor and you would have had lots of really interesting experiences. Cause I find that when you’re open to those sort of spaces by doing things like that, then more unusual things seem to happen. You’d have really great connections with people that you wouldn’t normally have and, and events happen that you wouldn’t expect. So what was happening for you in that?

Bjorn (14:27)
That was awesome.

Well, what’s interesting is something totally unexpected that happened for me was actually something within my physical body. I, growing up, I always struggled with things that would involve a lot of hand-eye coordination. And I never knew why I would struggle with that, but it was like things that would involve a lot of hand-eye coordination, I wouldn’t do so well.

CeeJay Barnaby (14:56)
Yeah, right.

Bjorn (15:15)
do things that were like limited movement, you know, something that where I, you know, was just tossing something or something like that. But anything that involved a lot of like, you know, catch and throw and whatever, or dancing, I struggled with. And what happened was that as soon as I started microdosing the mushroom,

First week, one evening I took an edible. I was in Amsterdam. I had this THC edible that I took while I was doing the microdosing. And something started happening with my vision where all of sudden everything that I was looking at looked totally different to me in the sense that I realized that somehow I was perceiving more depth

in all of the structures that I was looking at, more textures, deeper colors, and came to realize that up until that point in my life, now at this point I was in my mid-late 30s and maybe like 37, and I realized that my whole life, my two eyes basically were not

working together so that I had almost no depth perception.

And so I, you know, I, and I had always had an issue with, would stumble kind of sometimes when I would be walking. So when I did this microdosing, all that changed. And my hand eye coordination just started going up and up and up and up and up and it kept improving. And so I was experiencing the whole world so differently just because of that.

not to mention the fact that I was in all these new novel environments with new people and all these amazing architecture and things to soak in. it was quite an experience, quite something.

CeeJay Barnaby (17:03)
That sounds awesome. Now that led you around the world and you went to Chulam after that.

Bjorn (17:09)
yeah, that’s where I landed eventually. Am I kind of my last stop? Because I was living in most places for I’d say maybe a month. A lot of times some places I’d live for a few months. Sometimes I’d stay in a place for a week or few weeks, but I preferred staying in a place for a month or more.

CeeJay Barnaby (17:26)
taking it up.

Bjorn (17:27)
Yeah. And even though my, my vision had, you know, improved and I was having some great experiences, I still had some physical health issues that had been piling up over the years. I, my, I’ve had, I had high blood pressure from basically from my early twenties until my late thirties, you know, basic pre-hypertension. I, the previous two years of travel, I had started developing this sort of

arthritic type of condition in my knees where anytime I would be sitting still for more than a couple of minutes, this sort of stiffness would start setting in in my knees and I’d feel this urge like I needed to straighten my legs out and stretch them. And there were other things. And so I arrived into Lume mainly because

I had heard that it was one of the places that I could go during peak COVID where I would have some freedom of movement and that there were relatively few restrictions there. And that’s the type of environment that I was looking for. And so that actually was a large factor in the determinant of why I went there. And I had heard that it was a spiritual type of place too. And I had not really been to such a kind of place before.

did feel sort of drawn to that. And so I had a friend that was down there already and he had invited me down, so I went. I was there for a short period of time and my friend had an accident with his foot. His toe went, you know, got, was basically black and blue and his toenail had turned totally black. So it was like gonna fall off, pretty much guaranteed.

and i had just seen him two days prior and saw him again and he tells me hey take a look at my foot or my toe and i look and

It’s normal. There’s no discoloration, no black and blue. It’s like nothing had ever happened. And I asked him, how is that possible? Like, what’s going on here? And he told me, well, he went to this energy healing ceremony called the light portal. And when he left, it was like healed.

CeeJay Barnaby (19:30)
Yeah, cool.

That’s cool. Tell us about the light portal. We’ve got to know now. We’ve got to know.

Bjorn (19:44)
So.

Yeah, so it was like this shamanic group ceremony that they held once a week and my friend had found out about it because he was sitting at like a juice bar and he heard some girls talking about it that he wanted to hit on pretty much. And so he used it as a conversation opener to ask him about it then he ended up going and then he told me, you should come to the next one. I’m gonna go next week. He said he them every week.

Tuesday or Wednesday or something like that. So I went, I’m like, well, it seems interesting. I’m into Loom and I’m here to have experiences. Why not go? So I get to this place and there’s people lined up all around the room.

They are maybe 15, 20 people and the maybe had four or five facilitators running the show. And they had us going through a series of different things. First, we were doing group meditation, all sitting and they would just talk to us for a bit. And then they had everyone stand up and we were doing like movement combined with like open mouth breathing, breath work.

We did that for a long time. And then they had everyone lay down on our backs on the mats that were provided and continuing to do open mouth breathing while the facilitators would go around and do work on us, like energy work, physical, like touch type of work. And there was someone playing the drums, someone chanting.

There were a lot of different things going on at once because there were different sort of traditions, shamanic traditions being represented there by the different facilitators. At one point, this woman came up to me and started working on me. Her name was Ina. She’s from this like long lineage of Muslim healers. She’s from Indonesia and

She was working on me and she was digging into my tissue, my fascia, and she was finding these spots. It hurt a lot. Even though she’s this tiny little person. And when she got up to leave, after working on me, I started to laugh and I couldn’t stop. I was just laughing uncontrollably and found myself in quite a state of enjoyment.

And I thought, was no miraculous healing that just took place here, but it was an enjoyable experience. And I want to see, you know, take this further and see where it goes. So I booked a private session with Ina and her partner that was also one of the facilitators, Jose. He is a Spanish guy. They came to my apartment like the next week and.

had me put a mattress on the floor and, you know, worked on me for like an hour and a half, just digging into my tissue and doing stuff.

And so then we sat, the three of us, and we talked for little while and she spoke about the things that she observed when she was working on me, such as I noticed that these particular energies from your father’s line, fear, anger, and these things from your mother’s side, sadness, fear, whatever. then…

I saw these spirit guides, a jaguar and a Native American shaman and all these ideas are new to me, know, spirit guides and ancestral trauma, whatever. mean, I had no perception or really any opinions or thoughts about any of it. was reasonably open-minded about it, but I had no beliefs about any of it.

So she’s telling me, I saw all this stuff and I found these guides. Now, do you want to try and connect with the guides? Sure, why not? We’re here, aren’t we? So her partner, Jose, serves me a plant medicine called hape, which is known in some circles as shamanic snuff. So it’s a tobacco-based thing, but it has other components as well. It’s made by the indigenous native Amazon.

And they do these certain prayers over it and they combine other elements of nature that have psychoactive components to them You take it in the nose So he had this thing called a tape You have one end you You know one person’s blowing it into the other person’s nose basically so one person has the one end on their nose the other person’s over there blowing it I had never

I a hape before this, and so that was new to me too. So he serves me the hape. It burns badly. And I have no idea what to perceive at first. And so then Jose stands up and he walks right behind me and he’s got his maracas and he starts shaking them in my ears. And…

at this is the point where normally my mind would have stepped in and started to rationalize and explain to me what was going on in the room, like to explain to me like why I was feeling the way I was or what is, you know, why people were doing these things. But because he was shaking these maracas in my ears, my mind just couldn’t process anything. Right. Too much noise.

CeeJay Barnaby (25:15)
Shut it down. Shut it down. Yeah.

Bjorn (25:18)
And so he starts chanting. And next thing I know, I’m chanting. And as I’m chanting and I can’t stop chanting, I feel this force rising up within myself. And we’re talking about like something very powerful, like eternally powerful rising up, but then also some

really heavy, horrible, nasty, sticky feelings also being pushed up with it. And so once this chanting kind of expressed itself through me, I threw up a lot, know, purged in a bucket that they had there. I mean, a lot. And then I just laid there on the floor for several hours.

I didn’t even want to move. I didn’t even want to get on the couch that was next to me because the floor was so much solid and stable and the couch looked too like soft and like squishy and I wanted just the permanence of. Yes, badly. So I’m laying there on the floor for a few hours. Finally, I managed to get up on the couch and feel OK.

CeeJay Barnaby (26:20)
You want a grounding.

I completely understand.

Bjorn (26:31)
And I thought, well, I’m never doing this again. But then the next morning when I woke up, I realized all the tension and pain that I had had in my knees for the past several years was gone.

CeeJay Barnaby (26:36)
Yeah.

Bjorn (26:45)
and never came back.

CeeJay Barnaby (26:46)
That’s amazing.

Bjorn (26:48)
Yeah, so that led me on a path, you know. I… well, I…

CeeJay Barnaby (26:51)
You’re like, well, got,

yeah, you got to go and find more. That’s very cool. Amazing. Amazing. So how did you actually pursue that path after that? mean, obviously you’ve been invited by your experiences. What did you do next?

Bjorn (26:54)
Yeah.

Well, a lot of things with plant medicine for a while. So I tried ayahuasca and bufo and I had a series, a progressive series of experiences that were every bit as strong and powerful as that first awakening I had way back 11 years prior. But, you know, I had gone 11 years without having another experience like that and all of sudden I was having multiple things like that happening.

So with ayahuasca, Tulum was unique in that there were lot of indigenous tribes that would and shamans that would come up from the Amazon and actually do ceremonies there. So I got to sit with some very respectable, well-trained shamans that knew properly how to serve the medicine, which is super important with ayahuasca.

and some psychedelics like that. And so I sat with the Huni Kun, the Yawanawa, the Shippibo, the…

I’m trying to narrow things down to a few experiences that I can point to and talk about. my first time doing ayahuasca was with the Huni Kun and there were maybe 20 some participants there was a full house on this guy, Janna Ikikuru. You know, he’d been serving medicine since I think he was maybe 10 years old or something like that. And he was probably 30 years at least serving ayahuasca people.

And the Huni-kun, their process of doing ayahuasca is steeped in lot of traditional songs and chants that they do. he was commanding a lot of the ceremony, and he had these very specific chants that he was doing. So I took the medicine and didn’t really notice anything much for several hours. And I thought, well, I guess it doesn’t work for everyone.

And then they served the second round of medicine. And I thought, well, I mean, obviously I’ll take the second round. I barely feel anything from the first. So I took the second round. And they’re still doing some chance. I started feeling a little more relaxed, like, oh, hey, I feel kind of good now. Hmm, that’s nice. Nothing extraordinary, but it’s pretty nice. I think, you know, maybe I’ll go outside and sit by the fire for a few minutes.

I, so at the beginning of the ceremony, they had handed us all little buckets in case we needed to throw up during the ceremony. If we couldn’t make it outside in time, they had a receptacle and I’m walking outside, but I decided, you know, I’m going to grab my perch bucket. just had no idea like something could come on suddenly or what. So I took that with me and walked outside and I saw one of my teachers out there.

He looks at me, sees me holding the bucket, looks at the bucket, looks at me, shakes his head, says, put that down, you don’t need that. in retrospect, looking back on it, I realized that what he meant really was you don’t need that because you’re already outside. So if you need to purge, you can just go over the side there. But at the time, how I perceived it was,

you’re already past the point. You don’t need to purge. So just put the bucket down. You know, you’ve already moved past that. So he leaves. put the bucket down. And I just start dancing by myself by the fire. I don’t know. I feel free like a burden has been lifted. And then I start looking at the fire and then something starts happening between myself and the fire.

You could call it an experience of oneness where I suddenly felt like I was the fire and the fire was me. And that’s when I just had this massive feeling of a heart opening and just dropped to the ground overwhelmed by this wonderful sensations of love just coursing through my whole body.

the whole rest of the day I was pretty much laughing. I was laying there on the ground next to the fire just laughing. What do you know, like the whole situation is just, it’s really something, you know? And then I hear some another sound of laughter and I realized that there was someone else out there with me the whole time that I didn’t know on the other side of the fire. And so I’m laughing, then they’re laughing and we’re kind of like laughing back and forth and then.

That person turned out to become one of my best friends still is today And so that was my first experience with ayahuasca and

And then from there, my work with ayahuasca, I having a lot of very visual experiences, meeting different spiritual entities and my spirit guides and stuff and communicating with them. I also had an experience with a medicine called bufalvarious, which is known as the toad.

Excretion there are different names for it, but people know it by the toad because it there’s an excretion from a toad that they use There there was a Simpsons episode kind of making fun of that like a long time ago where people were licking toads and then getting high and then Anyhow So Bufo is a lot different like ayahuasca is like a journey you you’re in it for hours and hours

CeeJay Barnaby (32:15)
ever.

yeah, yeah, yeah.

yeah, yeah.

Bjorn (32:42)
Bufo is like 15, 20 minutes, you’re in it and then you’re out of it. Although the medicine stays with you for a long time, like several months, but the journey is like super strong, super fast and very short. So they told me they had this Bufo and you smoke it. So they lit the thing for me and I told me inhale and then.

when I inhale all the smoke, throw my arms up and fall back onto the mattress. So I did that.

Fall back onto this mattress.

and they had this sensation almost like someone had their fingernail in the center of my forehead and that they were digging into my head. It hurt like bad. And then the next thing I know, I saw this explosion of blue light everywhere. I mean, I’m laying here in an extremely deep state of medicine and meditation, a very deep trance.

There’s an explosion of blue light and then this song just erupts through me and I’m all of a sudden I’m singing the song in this language I didn’t know. And I’m not only singing this song, but I’m hearing myself make sounds that I’ve never made before. Like for highs and lows that…

I didn’t even think I was capable of doing, were coming through. that experience actually opened up my throat chakra. And I’ve been able to do that, sounds ever since. I did that. And so it eventually turned into, I started going to more ceremonies and people were hearing about the singing that I could do and they would ask me to sing.

CeeJay Barnaby (34:30)
Mm-hmm.

Bjorn (34:41)
when I would be in these ceremonies and so I would sing and then…

I was invited to actually join the light portal as a facilitator, the place where I first started as a participant. And so I worked there for several months doing the healing work. and then I withdrew, it kind of went through just this massive emotional purge that personally I had going on. Like you could call it depression, intense sadness. I don’t know what

CeeJay Barnaby (34:52)
Wow.

Bjorn (35:10)
how it would be defined, but it was basically like all day every day, I would just have these really super intense waves of sadness that were just like washing through me and it took over my life for about two months where I really couldn’t do much of anything other than deal with that. And after that happened, I met my next teacher.

Because I had gone in to get a chiropractic adjustment, but my chiropractor was out of town and there was a guy in there a cranial sacral therapist That they were like you want to do an appointment with him instead? Sure, why not? Well, sure. He was a cranial sacral therapist, but this guy had also trained with the shopee ball for like 10 or 20 years and The shopee ball, you know one of those lineages that do medicine songs

CeeJay Barnaby (35:54)
What?

Get wild.

Bjorn (35:59)
And so as it turns out, the session was this guy standing over me basically chanting, like channeling songs and like chanting at me. Sounds ridiculous, like talking about it in a normal conversation, but it was actually quite effective for me, I found. And so I ended up…

doing a lot more private sessions with him and I ended up going to an ayahuasca ceremony that he facilitated. then I, the last, one of the last things I did while I was still in Tulum was I did a, what’s known as a plant spirit diet that he facilitated. So it’s common, almost a rite of passage. You could almost say within like the shippibo lineage, but other lineage as well where

person will spend some time working with a master plant over a period of time. So instead of like going to a ceremony with the intention of having a visionary experience and then going back to your life, it’s like a longer contract where you’re working with the planning tool or maybe a month, three months, six months, whatever.

And you’re saying, I’m not going to have sex. I’m not going to eat sugar or these other foods. And it’s like a protocol. And you enter into that agreement to work with that plant and you have a teacher. And the idea is that you can have a much deeper, more profound experience than you ever would by working with a plant this way. And so I was working with a plant called Marossa.

And this particular diet, even though it was a plant spirit diet and there was a plant I was working with, I never actually physically took the plant. It was all done through sound, sonic vibration. At the Ayahuasca ceremony, the maestro, he implanted the energetic seed of the the morosa into my energy field. And then

We would meet over zoom every two or three weeks He would give me a chant a new chant and then I would be listening to this chant at least once day with the grounding ritual afterwards About a month into doing that I went for a walk one night and

As I was walking, I started to feel this warm sensation like in the top center of my chest.

And I kept walking and the sensation kept growing and then it sort of felt like what would be like the petals of a flower blooming all at once at the same time. It felt like that was happening there. And the next thing I know I’m in this state of total bliss, unconditional love and euphoria.

I mean, I was stumbling around like a drunk. I could barely walk. I was so swept up in this these feelings of oneness that were washing through me. It was like if I looked and whatever I would put my attention on, I would fall in love with the object of my attention and feel so connected to whether it was a tree, the road, a sign.

Anything. everywhere I looked in the air, basically, I was seeing these different combinations of colors that were like this beautiful, magnificent painting that always changed and shifted and evolved and the colors were the combination of colors was never the same. No matter where I look.

It always changed, but it was never any less beautiful.

It was like.

just an energetic rebirth for me. And after that, I wasn’t long before I came back to the States and had started the integration of everything.

CeeJay Barnaby (39:46)
That would have been quite a challenge going from one completely different world to the sort of like normal world and then having to ground all that into a normal life. how did you do that? And how did that manifest for you in your life then? What happened then?

Bjorn (40:04)
Well, the interesting thing too is I reason why I had to go back to the States is my father was in very poor health after his surgery and he has since passed now. So he never really fully recovered. And, and so not only was I back in the States, but I was in close proximity to my father who I still had a a number or a lot of tension in our relationship with.

And so what I did started doing almost immediately was adding some new routines into my day to support me energetically. And that included every morning I would, I started doing Qigong for movement and I would do some form of meditation before or after the Qigong. And then it wasn’t very long until I learned about this

modality called biofield tuning. And so I started listening to biofield tuning sessions, you know, which is like a form of sound healing, but very directional that uses tuning forks. And so I was listening to biofield tuning sessions. I was doing breath work, uh, and I was doing Qigong. And so I, every time, you know, something would come up emotionally, I was going in working in

figuring out how to manage it and how to move through the energy and deal with it. And it was very difficult, but it was, I was up to the challenge and over time it’s gotten easier and easier and easier and easier. And the experiences have gotten deeper and.

Now it’s like the way my life is on a daily basis is quite strange. way I experience energy now or the way I experience emotion is so physical. every time a wave of emotion passes through me, it sends like electric, it’s almost like the feeling of static electricity moving through my whole body and sending a chill kind of.

all the way up through my spine, through the top of my head, and it just pulses all the way through me. And doesn’t matter what the emotion is, whether it’s sadness, anger, or whatever, I experience them all the same way. if I’m, if my, if I, when my vibration is higher, you know, at a more natural higher state, that’s when I experience it like that. If I’m in a lower vibrational state, then I might,

If I experience an emotion, I might get more attached to it. And if I experience anger, then I might, you know, like think about what I’m angry about or whatever. But the more I do these practices, the more all the emotions basically feel the same to me, just like electricity moving through my body. It’s so, so odd. And so I didn’t really intend on making it into a healing practice, but once I started doing all this stuff with battlefield tuning,

I decided eventually that if I want to go further with this, I need to learn how to actually do it. So then I went through their practitioner training. And so then I was a certified biofuel tuner.

And then I started learning organically, started suddenly incorporating chanting with the forks. And I realized that I could sort of hack the efficiency of it and do much stronger work with the tuning. And eventually I learned how to use my voice to run the whole thing. And then I used, just use the forks as a sort of support. And so with that type of work, it’s actually quite potent.

And, you know, I’ve used it. It’s very useful for like shifting deeper patterns that sort of underpin the stories of the subconscious.

CeeJay Barnaby (43:55)
This developed into a path where you help others now.

Bjorn (43:58)
Well, I do sessions mainly, people cause, everything’s in the quantum field. So it’s just as strong receiving it through a zoom call or a Google meet than it is in person for the most part. And sometimes even more so. So I do these sessions with people where we do kind of, use sound, but then there’s some aspects of storytelling and other things that we use depending on the person to sort of.

let me to tune into their energy. then when we move a lot of energy during the session, a lot, a lot of times people need to take a nap afterward or do something just to like process everything. then very common for people to feel a big shift. So I do that. And then I have like a longer term program called a primal path and a podcast.

CeeJay Barnaby (44:52)
What’s the name of your podcast?

Bjorn (44:54)
Blue Dragon Healing. my podcast is the same name right now as my overall healing brand, though I may rebrand the name of the podcast.

CeeJay Barnaby (45:04)
Okay, and what’s the name of your website? Is that bluedragonhealing.com or something like that? .net, okay, that makes it easy for people to find. Can you offer any examples of successes that you’ve had with some of your clients with keeping their identities anonymized?

Bjorn (45:08)
.NET

Dotcom was already taken apparently, so.

Sure. Okay, there was some people come to me because they’re having trouble like moving past grief. So that’s one woman, had her father had passed away like a year prior and she was an entrepreneur. She was like teaching mindfulness and she was having trouble reconnecting to her creativity. And so we did a session and then she said,

After the session, I had to take a nap for a couple of hours just to process everything. But then when she woke up, she felt a very, very significant difference and has really, well, she’s now exploring doing like a longer term program with me. Um, but she had been coming to a lot of my, I do events on insight timer, like free events, uh, every Saturday.

And so she had been already coming to my events for a couple of months before we did the session and she really liked the work a lot and she wanted to experience it in a deeper way. And so we did.

CeeJay Barnaby (46:25)
Do you have any other examples of people going through great change?

Bjorn (46:28)
Yes. So there was another guy who he came to me. He had his struggle was grief also. One was the first one was the father. This one was from the mother. And so he had been on a path for a while. He had, you know, been teaching meditation and mindful meditation and and hypnosis. But he had

been feeling sort of blocked in his energy where he didn’t he got the sense that it wasn’t flowing evenly on both sides. And so we did a session and then within a week his podcast actually jumped from like unranked to like number four in the spirituality category in the US.

CeeJay Barnaby (47:14)
that for me? That’s awesome!

Bjorn (47:18)
I was like pretty amazed

and there was a lot of 300,000 some shows it jumped in the ranks. There’s like, it’s a lot of times really weird timing things that happen that coincide with the sessions.

CeeJay Barnaby (47:37)
think Terrence McKenna once said that, you know, shamans themselves actually, are really successful because they pick all the right patients. So, but I would take that even further and say that the universe puts the right people in front of you. So I don’t mean that they’re, ready to pop and then you’ve just got the key and you’re like, there’s your life now. Right.

Bjorn (47:53)
Yeah, makes sense.

Don’t get me wrong, I can help someone that’s earlier on in their path, but I’m finding that a lot of the people who come to me have been either they went on a really intense journey with plant medicine and they are trying to figure out how to integrate it into their life or they…

have been meditating regularly for years and they want to go deeper into their consciousness and experience energy in a new way.

CeeJay Barnaby (48:32)
Nice. Yeah. I think that’s something that a lot of people would really have great benefit from. I’ve got a question for you though.

As someone deeply influenced by shamanic traditions and plant medicines, how do those experiences continue to shape your own personal life today?

Bjorn (48:45)
Well…

When I do my chanting work, because I chant every day, it’s just it’s one way that I move my energy. And when I do, so when I chant, when I do breath work, when I go into deep meditative states, I experience a lot of the energy I experience, I experience it as nature. So like

Like when I just did a breath work before we hopped on here actually. And I saw like these beautiful trees and this forest. And I connected with that before we spoke and it made me feel amazing. And I still do some practices with different plants and I do diets with different plants. I did a diet earlier this year with a plant called

CeeJay Barnaby (49:21)
eyes.

Bjorn (49:31)
Chiricospy otherwise known as Chiricinango. I did that one without a maestro. Just did it by myself. I facilitated my own diet in that case and then that was super wonderful and I feel like in some ways there’s certain plants that don’t really serve me that well anymore like Santa Maria or a marijuana used to be when I would take that it would

cause me to really experience reality very differently or it would sort of bring up the things that were on my mind or the traumas I was holding and cause me to at least be able to get some space from them. But that experience was so much in my head and now when I use that medicine, everything I’m experiencing, almost all of it is

like from center, not up here. And so the shifts from that medicine are very subtle now and not super tangible or profound.

CeeJay Barnaby (50:29)
Okay. Do you have any tips for people to maintain authenticity in personal endeavors and professional interactions as a guide for others seeking connections? So what could you say to people to actually help them find their way to seek connection and keep authentic at the same time?

Bjorn (50:47)
Seek connection and stay authentic at the same time.

Well, the main trap was seeking connection. Like we’re talking about like connection with spirit. The main trap there is spiritual ego. And I fell into this trap too, because when I started having, especially because we going through and suddenly having very intense experiences with spirit, it caused me to think, hey, I’m a healer. I have these gifts. I’m the chosen one, whatever.

I really identified with the idea of being a shaman, being a healer, having other people see me that way and it was really important to me. People get really caught up in the ego of what those experiences mean when they connect.

The true connection, it comes to connect, then to embody and bring it back to the body. Learn not just how to connect with the divine masculine, the light, but also the divine feminine, the dark and the earth. And to stay grounded, because that will keep you humble. And that will actually be where you’ll experience the real rewards of your own gifts.

because it will help you stay more free from attachments that can take over your mind.

CeeJay Barnaby (52:09)
Yeah, I’ve been there too in the past having a bit of a spiritual ego and it is a trap. And I did get past it, but while I was in it, you know, it seemed all true and real, which is really odd. I found that when I got out of it, was like, why don’t even think that about me? That was so odd, you know? But when you’re in it, you don’t realize how deep you are in it until you get out the other side. And it’s good to actually recognize that you can actually talk yourself into things too. It’s like, that means this.

Bjorn (52:23)
Ha ha.

CeeJay Barnaby (52:38)
You know what I mean? And it’s not true. It’s just another narrative that you get to live.

Bjorn (52:39)
Yeah.

Yeah,

the whole subconscious mind is like it runs on stories and what is a story other than a cause and effect scenario and what are beliefs but other than mini micro stories like, if this thing happens, it means this thing. And it’s like drawing associations and conclusions because the mind wants to make sense and keep us safe.

CeeJay Barnaby (52:55)
Yeah.

Bjorn (53:06)
for the most part and it’s just doing its job but…

CeeJay Barnaby (53:09)
Yeah. Yeah. But sometimes that job isn’t so effective. So it’s good to like, like you’ve learned to, to, send to yourself from ground, you know, and doing so that, assist you in, negotiating the world in a more authentic way. Yeah. Well, Bjorn it’s been a really good talk. I’ve enjoyed everything that you’ve shared and, I’ll, what I’ll do is, we’ll just say that your website again is blue dragon healing.net.

Yep. That’s how everyone can find you. Is there anyone anywhere else you’d like them to look you up?

Bjorn (53:40)
That should cover it all I mean I’m on insight timer and other places But I have a resources page on my website and they can find the links to everything else through there

CeeJay Barnaby (53:49)
Excellent. Excellent. Yeah. So, inside time off everyone is a really good app for meditation. So if you don’t know about that one, it’s on pretty much everything, Android, iPhone, all those sort of things. So, again, thank you so much for your time, but you want to spend a pleasure talking with you and, and I’ve appreciated all that you shared. So, I’ll just say goodbye to the listeners and I’ll just get you to wait for a second. All right. I’ll say goodbye. Goodbye to listeners.

Bjorn (54:10)
Thank you.

CeeJay Barnaby (54:11)
Thank you.

I trust that you enjoyed that episode of Super Normalized. did intensely because it was so good to hear somebody speak so authentically about their experiences and how they view the world and how that had changed for them. Bjorn shares so deeply and I’d appreciate it if you actually reached out to Bjorn and say thank you for coming on the episode because it was so good. And if you’ve enjoyed today’s episode, like and subscribe. mean, that’s what you got to do. I mean, seriously, if you got this far, please, please do.

And if you’re on the podcast app, give me a five star rating and say something nice. That’d really appreciated. So thank you so much for listening until next episode. It’s bye for now.